Sun
Aug 17 2008
11:25 am
By: R. Neal

If you missed last night's interviews* with the presumptive nominees, you missed the upcoming election in a nutshell. It's going to be a replay of 2004, with the same manufactured wedge issues plus a side order of fear mongering, and both candidates said all they are going to say about them between now and November.

When is Kos going to denounce Obama for saying he does not support gay marriage, like he did Harold Ford Jr. ("I want Ford to win. But I won't cry when he doesn't.")?

Anyway, it was a pretty good format. McCain gave short and to-the-point party line talking point answers. Obama gave more contemplative and thoughtful answers. Both were given plenty of time to answer and the absence of barking and jabbering by preening network TV moderators was nice. For the most part, both performed well, both did their share of pandering to the religious right audience, and both likely scored points with viewers in their respective camps.

P.S. Who is Rick Warren and why does he get 120 minutes on CNN to interview candidates for President of the United States?

(*CNN will re-broadcast it tonight at 8PM.)

Johnny Ringo's picture

When is Kos going to

When is Kos going to denounce Obama for saying he does not support gay marriage, like he did Harold Ford Jr.

Right after he loses the election, just like everyone else.

[Edit] Or, if he wins, right after he leaves office. See, e.g., WJ Clinton.

MartyD's picture

His church is in California

His church is in California and unlike many big bucks evangelicals he and his wife give away most of their earnings to good works.

Sven's picture

Purpose-driven strife: RW:

Purpose-driven strife:

RW: People say America is not the policeman of the world. We may not be, but the Bible says, if you have been blessed, then you are to care for people who can't care for themselves, you are to speak up for people who can't speak for themselves, and to defend the defenseless.

JG: Some people argue that we're not so great ourselves.

RW: The difference is that there are no death squads in America. The worst you can get here is that you can get blogged, you can get Lewinskied(!), on the Internet...That's why whether or not they found weapons of mass destruction in Iraq is beside the point. Saddam and his sons were raping the country, literally. And we morally had to do something. If you have a Judeo-Christian heritage, you have to believe it when God says that evil cannot be compromised with. It has to be resisted, it has to be overcome.

Ok, then.

Policies are judged by their consequences, but crusades are judged by how good they make the crusaders feel

- Thomas Sowell(!)

Sven's picture

Huh: The poll, which shows

Huh:

The poll, which shows Obama ahead of McCain 43 percent to 34 percent among likely voters, also finds Obama leading in 18 of 19 different religious faith communities defined by the survey’s strict standards. McCain leads in only one—evangelicals. In that category, however, the Republican has a huge lead, 61 to 17.

R. Neal's picture

Wonder if a Rabbi will get a

Wonder if a Rabbi will get a crack at them on MSNBC or something?

happy holler's picture

McCain's "Ben Hur" story

I was shocked to hear McCain tell that dubious story about meeting a Christian Viet Cong while he was in the Hanoi Hilton, and signaling to him with the sign of the cross. The same thing happened to Charlton Heston in the 1950's movie "Ben Hur." Either McCain is a sleazy liar, or unbalanced fantasist.

happy holler's picture

More on the Cross in the Dirt tale

This hoary old chestnut is also recounted in Solzhenitsyn's 1973 Gulag Archipelago. Boy, that secretly Christian Viet Cong guard sure gets around!

Rachel's picture

I was surprised to hear that

I was surprised to hear that tickets were sold for something like $250-$500. And that they were only available for church members.

Not exactly an Obama audience.

Let's hear them go talk to the Sierra Club next. Or the ACLU.

Edit: Oops, it was $500-$2000 a ticket!

Sven's picture

$500-$2000 a ticket! Bah,

$500-$2000 a ticket!

Bah, 'tis peanuts. As McCain pointed out, the median US income is $5 million.

Rachel's picture

As McCain pointed out, the

As McCain pointed out, the median US income is $5 million.

Now be fair. He only said that was what it took to be considered "rich." And he keedz, he keedz.

redmondkr's picture

In A Night to Remember,

In A Night to Remember, Walter Lord quoted an Astor as saying at the turn of the twentieth century, "The way things are today, a man with a million dollars could live as though he were rich."


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Sven's picture

I really shouldn't joke

I really shouldn't joke about these things. Cindy McCain could take me out with one thwack of her credit card statement.

Good point.

Rachel's picture

Thinking about last night's

Thinking about last night's discussion (it was NOT a debate) a bit more. At one point John McCain said he wanted to make everybody rich. But didn't Jesus say that "the poor will be with you always?"

Why does John McCain hate Jesus? (Ok, that's a joke for those of you who are humor-impaired.)

R. Neal's picture

Cringe-worthy

Cringe-worthy moments:

• When Obama failed to name health care as America's worst moral failing.

• When McCain named Gen. Petraeus as his top-most trusted and influential adviser and confidant (or however the question was phrased.)

jsmith's picture

That's 'above my pay grade.'

Asked at what point a baby gets “human rights,” Obama, who strongly supports abortion rights, said: “whether you’re looking at it from a theological perspective or a scientific perspective, answering that question with specificity … is above my pay grade.”

If Obama is saying that the answer to that question is unknowable, wouldn't it make sense to err on the side of caution and protect pre-natal life? He seems to be allowing the possiblity that pre-natal children should have human rights, but is completely comfortable with snuffing out their lives, right up to (and beyond) the point of delivery.

Speaking with CBN’s David Brody immediately after the Saddleback forum, Obama gets snitty when asked about the “Born Alive Infant Protection Act.”

Check it out:

(link...)

The King Inference from Nobama's people:
"Uh....Uh.... Ahhhh.....Ahhh, McCain..uhhh, he cheated and uhh..he was not in the....Ahhh cone of...uhhhh...silence. That’s why he..uhhhh...beat me last...uhhhh...night.

Rachel's picture

Asked at what point a baby

Asked at what point a baby gets “human rights

Actually, the phrasing of that question wasn't exactly unbiased.

All BABIES have human rights. I just reject the idea that an unviable embryo is a baby.

RayCapps's picture

Well...

That rather assumes you believe rights are granted rather than inherent. Carry on.

Barbara O'Brien's picture

"If Obama is saying that the

"If Obama is saying that the answer to that question is unknowable, wouldn't it make sense to err on the side of caution and protect pre-natal life?"

I would err on the side of assuming that women are human beings and not brood animals.

jsmith's picture

LOL!

You’re showing a fundamental misunderstanding of Pascal's Wager. You are imposing certain comments on the argument which are not part of the argument at all. Your response is nonsensical.

But I know you tried really, really hard to sound smart.

tin cup's picture

This says it all

This says it all Rachel:

"Obama audience.

Sierra Club Or the ACLU."

Rachel's picture

Both of which I belong to,

Both of which I belong to, BTW. Now tell me how unAmerican I am.

I was simply pointing out that the audience Saturday night was not a cross-section of Americans - it was limited to members of Warren's church who could afford the $500-$2000 ticket to get in. That audience is naturally biased in McCain's favor.

And yes, the Sierra Club and the ACLU would probably be biased in Obama's favor. Although I suspect they would open the doors to the general public and make the event free.

jsmith's picture

Suggestions for jobs within Obama's pay grade.

Chief panderer?
Commander in chief of community organizing?
President...of Harvard?

He needs something nice and quiet. Something without too much responsibility.

This will make a wonderful commercial:
“Being president is above Obama’s pay grade.”

Damn, this guy is an idiot.

Nelle's picture

Flapper Pie

INGREDIENTS

* 1 1/2 cups graham cracker crumbs
* 1/4 cup white sugar
* 1/3 cup butter, softened
* 1/2 cup white sugar
* 2 tablespoons cornstarch
* 1 tablespoon all-purpose flour
* 1/2 teaspoon salt
* 2 cups milk
* 2 egg yolks, beaten
* 1 tablespoon butter
* 1 teaspoon vanilla extract
* 3 egg whites
* 1/4 cup white sugar
* 1/2 teaspoon almond extract

DIRECTIONS

1. Mix together graham cracker crumbs, 1/4 cup sugar, and 1/3 cup softened butter or margarine. Press into a 9 inch pie plate, reserve 1/4 cup for topping. Bake at 375 degrees F (190 degrees C) for 8 minutes.
2. Mix 1/2 cup sugar, cornstarch, flour, and salt in a saucepan. Stir in milk gradually. Cook over medium heat, stirring until mixture comes to a boil and thickens. Cook 2 minutes more. Add a little of this hot mixture to beaten egg yolks, then stir yolks into hot mixture. Cook 1 minute while stirring. Remove from heat; stir in 1 tablespoon butter or margarine and vanilla. Cool 15 minutes, and pour into crumb crust. Cool completely.
3. Beat egg whites until soft peaks form. Slowly add 1/4 cup sugar, beating until stiff and glossy. Stir in almond extract. Spread meringue over filling, and against the edge of crust to seal. Sprinkle with reserved crumbs.
4. Bake at 425 degrees F (220 degrees C) just until meringue is golden, about 4 to 5 minutes. Cool completely before serving.

tin cup's picture

the Sierra Club and the ACLU

the Sierra Club and the ACLU would probably be biased in Obama's favor.

This is what libs don't get.....it's the white guys in hard hats in Ohio and Pennsylvania and Michigan who will decide this election..........for McCain. The Demo's have become the party of the ACLU and Hollywood.

rikki's picture

white guys in hard hats in

white guys in hard hats in Ohio and Pennsylvania and Michigan who will decide this election

Why would guys in hard hats vote for more jobs going overseas, further erosion of their pensions and health coverage, more bank failures, more of their National Guard buddies in harm's way in distant lands and more of their tax dollars going to crony contractors? Guys in hard hats know the Republican Party is a fraud.

There is no rational reason to vote for McCain. That's why Republicans are feverishly trying to drum up votes against Obama and looking for ways to short-circuit rational thought. You and your fellow "conservatives" are making it obvious that hateful irrationality is all Republicans have going for them.

Andy Axel's picture

Hard-hats in Ohio didn't

Hard-hats in Ohio didn't swing the election for Bush last time around. A bunch of nogoodniks who misallocated voting machines to populous, Democratic leaning districts did. Ratfuckers with badges and titles like "Secretary of State" got the job done. White-collar assholes putting together "caging lists" to disqualify hundreds of legitimate voters decided the election.

____________________________

"It's gettin' so a businessman can't expect no return from a fixed fight. Now, if you can't trust a fix, what can you trust?"

James Calloway's picture

Obama

got his ass handed to him and everyone on this list knows it. It was entertaining listening to him try to get digs in on Clarence Thomas, a man who has spent years building up quite an impressive resume while Obama was out being a street hood or whatever the hell he said he was doing in Chicago before he spent less time in the Senate than I did learning the ins and outs of C#.

Rachel's picture

got his ass handed to him

got his ass handed to him

That's an interesting way of thinking about what was billed as a "civil forum." In a church, no less.

Nelle's picture

Bavarian Strawberry Pie -- no baking required!

INGREDIENTS

* 2 1/2 cups flaked coconut
* 1/3 cup butter, melted
* 1 quart fresh strawberries, sliced
* 3/4 cup sugar
* 1 (.25 ounce) envelope unflavored gelatin
* 1/2 cup cold water
* 2 teaspoons lemon juice
* 1 cup heavy whipping cream, whipped

DIRECTIONS

1. In a small bowl, combine coconut and butter. Press onto the bottom and up the sides of a greased 9-in. pie plate. Bake at 300 degrees F for 30-35 minutes or until lightly browned (cover edges loosely with foil to prevent overbrowning if necessary). Cool on a wire rack.
2. In a large bowl, combine strawberries and sugar; let stand for 15 minutes. In a small saucepan, sprinkle gelatin over cold water; let stand for 1 minute. Cook and stir over medium heat until gelatin is dissolved; stir in lemon juice. Stir into strawberry mixture. Cool to room temperature. Fold in whipped cream. Pour into crust. Refrigerate for at least 4 hours before slicing.

redmondkr's picture

Four More Years?


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tin cup's picture

There is no rational reason

There is no rational reason to vote for McCain.

You're wrong Rikki. There is one very rational reason to vote for McCain.....Obama. I admit that I can't think of many other good reasons but that one is enough for me and lots of friends I know.

We'll see who the white hard hats vote for.

Rachel's picture

Let's bug Tin Cup's golf bag

Let's bug Tin Cup's golf bag for his next round. I wonder what he says about Obama, after looking over each shoulder carefully, when he's on the green.

That's assuming he doesn't play at Cherokee, where looking over his shoulder wouldn't be required.

Whoops - posted this before I saw R. Neal's post. Great minds etc. etc.

rikki's picture

You're wrong Rikki. There is

You're wrong Rikki. There is one very rational reason to vote for McCain.....Obama.

If you're going to say I'm wrong, don't prove my point with your next sentence.

R. Neal's picture

after looking over each

after looking over each shoulder carefully

If he plays Cherokee he doesn't even have to look over his shoulder.

tin cup's picture

Nice analysis, Ax. If the

Nice analysis, Ax. If the GOP is smart enough to steal two elections in a row, maybe we need to keep electing them.

Ratfuckers with badges and titles like "Secretary of State" got the job done.

BTW, where are the baby rats?

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